The final moments of tape make a powerful impression. And the fact that you could tell the history and implications of this call in a shorter period of time than those two men spoke that day, is also quite illustrative
Brilliant and powerful presentation of the 14 minute gap! Oswald was definitely NOT in Mexico City, and LBJ & Hoover had proof of it. They could've told Americans, that almost three months before the assassination, SOMEONE, had obviously framed Oswald, with phony photos and audiotapes, that were concocted to implicate him in attempting to meet with Kostikov, head of the Soviet assassination teams. And that their obvious goal was to frame him in a "Commie plot" to assassinate JFK, a plot that could be used as an excuse to start a war - a nuclear war, with the USSR.
The ONLY ones that could have known about Oswald in advance, AND could've pulled such strings to "patsify" him, almost 3 months in advance, was the CIA - not the Mafia, not the Russians, not General Walker & his racist neo-Nazi followers. ONLY the CIA controlled the cameras and taping equipment in Mexico City! They were the very agency that used anti-Castro Cuban exiles, illegally trained in secret CIA camps in the U.S., in multiple unsuccessful attempts to assassinate Castro. And they were the very agency that illegally created, organized and funded the Anti-Castro Cuban group, DRE, who George Joannides, CIA Dep DIr. of Psychological Warfare at JMWAVE funded to the tune of $50,000/mo. ($510,346/mo today) to dirty up Oswald, on film, just in time for the assassination. And it was CIA's DRE Leader, Carlos Bringuier, who wrote a letter on Aug 31, 1963 asking for Congress to investigate Lee Harvey Oswald, and for Americans to write to their Congressman to pressure them to investigate Lee Harvey Oswald.: https://web.archive.org/web/20140406223107/https://jfkfacts.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Bringueir-PR-082163.jpg
And it was the CIA's DRE who and who then put out a newspaper article about Oswald as the Commie "lone assassin" immediately after the assassination.:
All of this, an illegal psychological warfare operation on domestic soil, to pull off their coup d'etat! As is their 60+ years of gaslighting and coverup.
The pattern is obvious. The trail of breadcrumbs leads right to the CIA's doorstep.
Rather than tell Americans this dirty truth about the CIA, Johnson and Hoover let the "patsy" take the fall, and then pressured the WC to blame it all on the "lone nut" Oswald, and sweep it under the rug, "to prevent a nuclear war" - something they could've and should've done by laying the blame where it belonged, at the feet of the CIA. Why lay it at Oswald's feet? Because the CIA had kompromat on both of them, and have likely had kompromat on every President since, to get them to continue the coverup. And if kompromat wasn't sufficient, there were always the endless, nightmarish mental reruns of JFK's explosive execution in broad daylight, as a reminder of just who was REALLY in power, and what would happen to THEM if they didn't continue the charade.
You have me thinking about the guy in the plaid coat recently. Since reading "A Woman I Know" I've been considering the possibility that the CIA allowed the assassination to occur more than orchestrating it. Brian Latell complicates what we thought we knew.
LGZ, you are really dialing-in on the responsible parties and the “lone assassin” who lingers with a dubious frame around his soul?! Can you interpolate my Z313 superimposed over Z312 from the curb drain?
Thank you, Eldon! Sorry, but I don't think we will ever see eye to eye on the trajectory from the storm drain.
I believe both the head shot and the throat shot were from the South Knoll. The throat shot thru the windshield. When the Parkland docs did the trach, they looked inside and could see the damage to the trachea showing a tangential LEFT TO RIGHT trajectory that ended over the apex of the RT lung with a hematoma. That can't happen from the GK or the storm drain. The only possibility is the SK.
In addition, In '65 Finck wrote a letter to Brig. Gen. J.M. Blumberg, The Director of the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology in D.C.
SUBJECT: Autopsy of President Kennedy
SUBJECT: Personal Notes On the Assassination of President Kennedy
Saying the damage to the tie knot "which indicates a tangential path on the LEFT side in relation to the knot."
So this corroborates what Dr. Perry, McClelland etc said about the damage to the trachea showing a LEFT TO RIGHT trajectory. A left to rt trajectory is only possible for the South Knoll, not the Grassy Knoll, or from the storm drain.
Where did the "throat shot" bullet exit? Did it exit? If it did not, why was it not found, at the ER or at Bethesda?
What cervical spinal structures were damaged by this bullet?
The damage to the knot of JFK's necktie may have been from scalpel useage to remove the tie. You have worked in the ER, right? They don't leisurely undress critical patients on admission. They cut and rip off their clothing ASAP.
It didn't exit. It couldn't be seen visually at Parkland, when they cursorily looked inside while doing trach (no Xrays were taken at PH - no time) or found visually or on xray at Bethesda. That is NOT possible. There had to have been a bullet that caused the wound. My feeling is it wasn't seen in the cursory examination at PH, because it was obscured by the bleeding into the tissues and the large hematoma that WAS seen visually in the Rt apical area. (EDIT: Because of this, and also because Perry et al noted mild leftward mediastinal shift, caused by pressure build up of bleeding into the RT lung apical area, and they also noted the trachea was shifted slightly leftward; Perry ordered chest tubes be inserted and hooked up to drainage. FYI - A MEDIASTINAL SHIFT can also put pressure on the heart, shifting it to the left, and compromising cardiac output, and is a considered to be a life threatening event that needs immediate treatment - ie: chest tube insertion). They didn't have time to go hunting for it. A normal trach incision is normally about 25-35mm wide (2.5-3.0 cm) - around an inch wide.
My feeling is the missile was removed, probably via fluoroscopy, - a technique used since the WWI - by Humes in his pre-autopsy surgery on the body in the time between 6:30 and 8pm, and this is also when Perry's small trach incision was widened into the 3+inch wide, ugly, gaping, gash seen on photos at Bethesda, when Humes was digging it out.
As for cutting clothing off of people in the ER, nurses and doctors ONLY use BANDAGE SCISSORS - not sharp pointed scissors! Ever! Bandage scissors have BLUNT ROUNDED edges on the tips of both blades. They would've run the blunt round end of the bottom scissors blade under the tie band and cut it. I've done this myself in the ER, so know what I'm talking about. There would be no chance for nicking the tie knot. So, I don't at all buy that the hole in the tie was caused by cutting off JFK's clothing. But of course, they know that most people don't know anything about this - so trot this out this LIE as an explanation for the tie hole.
Let’s not forget that former Vice-President Nixon was in Dallas 11/21/63. When Nixon finally became President, his Vice-President Agnew, now known as “Bagman,” was forced to resign. Wonder where he learned that trade?
I actually was able to listen to the tape of the conversation between LBJ and Hoover, which took place 1st thing the following morning of the assassination. It could be found on the internet in the mid-90's. Years later, when I found out it had been erased, I couldn't believe it. More solid proof of the government cover-up. ( As though there wasn't enough already). I called a friend immediately to jog his memory, as I had given him a heads up to listen to the conversation. And yes, he confirmed he had also listened to it. More evidence that's been washed and laundered through the years. The CIA knows how to do their job. And guess what? They don't have to answer to anyone, including our lawmakers. Sad but true.
"They don't have to answer to anyone, including our lawmakers."
What federal agency does have to answer to the people's representatives now, even about non-classified information that has no relation to national security (unless everything relates to national security)?
You have your own answer here, "In the best interest of the United States!" in one catch phrase the chicken hawks falsely espouse, the other is "In the interest National Security", is another. "(unless everything relates to national secuirty)? Son since the Patriot Act that is exactly the way the fascists see it.!
FYI back o April 11, here Morley presented The Trail of Destruction In New Orleans. You commented on what I had written and I replied.
You commented in the form of a series of question to me. I just now returned here from posting an apology to you and everyone else scratching your heads.
I neglected to inform the readers that I considered you very first question as being two. I intended to address this then but I got on a role of sorts and forgot, the little nugget about the first question as being one that needed two answers. It is definitely a mental glitch.
Linda Giovanna Zambanini comment below rigs true to me I'm 100% agreement.
The CIA has some very serious problems JFK had to die. CIA had LBJ and Hoover by the gonads, well at the very least they had LBJ by the gonads, I will not speculate on what they had JEH by, his skirt tails maybe.
So everyone remember this CIA went all-in, the had no choice and developed a whale of a tail, no disrespect to whales intended. Given what we have learned about this tape being erased in the middle ~ 1990's is proof they are still actively engaged in destroying evidence. Remember Jeff's comments about CIA going to extraordinary lengths to provide a cover story? Don't think for one second they are ready to give up the fight.
Kennedy had to die, or else CIA could go away. No much has changed except the stakes are higher now because the fools who continue to push the Oswald lie simply will not allow themselves to give up any of their grossly overblown powers and they have members of congress, how shall we say it without being to crass, by the genitals.
At the top you say this conversation took place on the morning of November 22nd 1963. Contextually it seems like you meant to say November 23rd. Otherwise you have the smoking gun of the last century. Please confirm
Glad to help. In my book ASK NOT! I had many times during the editorial process to correct facts and attributions. So I know how something like that can slip by. But I must say, for a split second, I thought it was earth-shattering news! :)
That is such a good presentation. I am sure I actually heard that tape and, from memory, it was sometime in the 70's. Many years later I discussed it with someone and went looking for it to show my dubious friend. It was gone.
Not the only piece of compelling evidence to disappear.
The sound of the 6 second intervals of audible pulses in the blank tape is reminiscent of the awful finality of the cadence of Chopin's funeral march played by the military band in JFK's procession to his final resting place at Arlington. I shall never forget that weekend.
J. Edgar Hoover was duped for many years by a Kremlin-loyal triple agent by the name of Aleksei Kulak (FEDORA) at the Bureau's NYC field office. Kulak was the KGB's "outside man" to probable KGB "mole" Bruce Solie's "inside man" in the devastating feedback loop they formed against U.S. intelligence. Solie, a high-level officer in the CIA's mole-hunting Office of Security, was the confidant, mentor, and mole-hunting boss of father figure-requiring James Angleton, and he worked closely with the FBI. It was Kulak who made Valeriy Kostikov's name "radioactive" by telling the FBI several months before Oswald allegedly went to Mexico City that Kostikov's colleague, Igor Brykin at the UN, was a member of Department 13.
Superb! It’s been my view that LBJ and JEH came to an understanding very quickly to hang it on LHO as the lone gunman. Notwithstanding neither believing it was that simple. Both put a lid on any notion of the Washington apparatus of the state being involved or duplicity. They had an understanding that as two very effective operatives in D.C. they could pull off the lone gunman theory, block CiA further mischief, ensure they both could carry on in the jobs they craved. In a short time LBJ reappoints JEH. Investigations of LBJ business in Texas fades. One could say a “grand alliance”. Most evidence points to neither believing the official narrative.
From the Mary Ferrel site : "the fact that many people and groups had motive to kill JFK, making proving motive no more than a starting point. Another dilemma for those who study the case in search of answers is the need to separate acts of coverup from the conspiracy itself."
Each new "fact"only seems to hide the truth about who or what group killed JFK. Erasing tapes, destroying or refusing to release public information after ordered to by congress seems to only add to the confusion.
The evil, murderous people behind JFK's murder were very skilled at covering the trail to the truth. These were not amateurs but professional killers and some of them are probably still alive.
My guess is the erased 14 mins was a discussion about the public response if it was revealed Oswald was impersonated calling the Russian consulate discussing a wet ops Russian spy.
It’s obvious this conversation was the impetus for the Katzenbach memo the next day after LHO’s death. And who knows if Hoover was told to look the other way on LHO’s security measures that day by the DPD.
Cuz we all know if Oswald was guilty, the USG woulda made sure he was alive for trial.
Bravo
The final moments of tape make a powerful impression. And the fact that you could tell the history and implications of this call in a shorter period of time than those two men spoke that day, is also quite illustrative
Brilliant and powerful presentation of the 14 minute gap! Oswald was definitely NOT in Mexico City, and LBJ & Hoover had proof of it. They could've told Americans, that almost three months before the assassination, SOMEONE, had obviously framed Oswald, with phony photos and audiotapes, that were concocted to implicate him in attempting to meet with Kostikov, head of the Soviet assassination teams. And that their obvious goal was to frame him in a "Commie plot" to assassinate JFK, a plot that could be used as an excuse to start a war - a nuclear war, with the USSR.
The ONLY ones that could have known about Oswald in advance, AND could've pulled such strings to "patsify" him, almost 3 months in advance, was the CIA - not the Mafia, not the Russians, not General Walker & his racist neo-Nazi followers. ONLY the CIA controlled the cameras and taping equipment in Mexico City! They were the very agency that used anti-Castro Cuban exiles, illegally trained in secret CIA camps in the U.S., in multiple unsuccessful attempts to assassinate Castro. And they were the very agency that illegally created, organized and funded the Anti-Castro Cuban group, DRE, who George Joannides, CIA Dep DIr. of Psychological Warfare at JMWAVE funded to the tune of $50,000/mo. ($510,346/mo today) to dirty up Oswald, on film, just in time for the assassination. And it was CIA's DRE Leader, Carlos Bringuier, who wrote a letter on Aug 31, 1963 asking for Congress to investigate Lee Harvey Oswald, and for Americans to write to their Congressman to pressure them to investigate Lee Harvey Oswald.: https://web.archive.org/web/20140406223107/https://jfkfacts.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Bringueir-PR-082163.jpg
And it was the CIA's DRE who and who then put out a newspaper article about Oswald as the Commie "lone assassin" immediately after the assassination.:
https://web.archive.org/web/20140426005037/http://jfkfacts.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/VERSO2.jpg
All of this, an illegal psychological warfare operation on domestic soil, to pull off their coup d'etat! As is their 60+ years of gaslighting and coverup.
The pattern is obvious. The trail of breadcrumbs leads right to the CIA's doorstep.
Rather than tell Americans this dirty truth about the CIA, Johnson and Hoover let the "patsy" take the fall, and then pressured the WC to blame it all on the "lone nut" Oswald, and sweep it under the rug, "to prevent a nuclear war" - something they could've and should've done by laying the blame where it belonged, at the feet of the CIA. Why lay it at Oswald's feet? Because the CIA had kompromat on both of them, and have likely had kompromat on every President since, to get them to continue the coverup. And if kompromat wasn't sufficient, there were always the endless, nightmarish mental reruns of JFK's explosive execution in broad daylight, as a reminder of just who was REALLY in power, and what would happen to THEM if they didn't continue the charade.
You have me thinking about the guy in the plaid coat recently. Since reading "A Woman I Know" I've been considering the possibility that the CIA allowed the assassination to occur more than orchestrating it. Brian Latell complicates what we thought we knew.
LGZ, you are really dialing-in on the responsible parties and the “lone assassin” who lingers with a dubious frame around his soul?! Can you interpolate my Z313 superimposed over Z312 from the curb drain?
Thank you, Eldon! Sorry, but I don't think we will ever see eye to eye on the trajectory from the storm drain.
I believe both the head shot and the throat shot were from the South Knoll. The throat shot thru the windshield. When the Parkland docs did the trach, they looked inside and could see the damage to the trachea showing a tangential LEFT TO RIGHT trajectory that ended over the apex of the RT lung with a hematoma. That can't happen from the GK or the storm drain. The only possibility is the SK.
In addition, In '65 Finck wrote a letter to Brig. Gen. J.M. Blumberg, The Director of the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology in D.C.
SUBJECT: Autopsy of President Kennedy
SUBJECT: Personal Notes On the Assassination of President Kennedy
Saying the damage to the tie knot "which indicates a tangential path on the LEFT side in relation to the knot."
So this corroborates what Dr. Perry, McClelland etc said about the damage to the trachea showing a LEFT TO RIGHT trajectory. A left to rt trajectory is only possible for the South Knoll, not the Grassy Knoll, or from the storm drain.
Where did the "throat shot" bullet exit? Did it exit? If it did not, why was it not found, at the ER or at Bethesda?
What cervical spinal structures were damaged by this bullet?
The damage to the knot of JFK's necktie may have been from scalpel useage to remove the tie. You have worked in the ER, right? They don't leisurely undress critical patients on admission. They cut and rip off their clothing ASAP.
It didn't exit. It couldn't be seen visually at Parkland, when they cursorily looked inside while doing trach (no Xrays were taken at PH - no time) or found visually or on xray at Bethesda. That is NOT possible. There had to have been a bullet that caused the wound. My feeling is it wasn't seen in the cursory examination at PH, because it was obscured by the bleeding into the tissues and the large hematoma that WAS seen visually in the Rt apical area. (EDIT: Because of this, and also because Perry et al noted mild leftward mediastinal shift, caused by pressure build up of bleeding into the RT lung apical area, and they also noted the trachea was shifted slightly leftward; Perry ordered chest tubes be inserted and hooked up to drainage. FYI - A MEDIASTINAL SHIFT can also put pressure on the heart, shifting it to the left, and compromising cardiac output, and is a considered to be a life threatening event that needs immediate treatment - ie: chest tube insertion). They didn't have time to go hunting for it. A normal trach incision is normally about 25-35mm wide (2.5-3.0 cm) - around an inch wide.
My feeling is the missile was removed, probably via fluoroscopy, - a technique used since the WWI - by Humes in his pre-autopsy surgery on the body in the time between 6:30 and 8pm, and this is also when Perry's small trach incision was widened into the 3+inch wide, ugly, gaping, gash seen on photos at Bethesda, when Humes was digging it out.
As for cutting clothing off of people in the ER, nurses and doctors ONLY use BANDAGE SCISSORS - not sharp pointed scissors! Ever! Bandage scissors have BLUNT ROUNDED edges on the tips of both blades. They would've run the blunt round end of the bottom scissors blade under the tie band and cut it. I've done this myself in the ER, so know what I'm talking about. There would be no chance for nicking the tie knot. So, I don't at all buy that the hole in the tie was caused by cutting off JFK's clothing. But of course, they know that most people don't know anything about this - so trot this out this LIE as an explanation for the tie hole.
Let’s not forget that former Vice-President Nixon was in Dallas 11/21/63. When Nixon finally became President, his Vice-President Agnew, now known as “Bagman,” was forced to resign. Wonder where he learned that trade?
There’s also the rumor that LBJ and Connelly started planning the assassination in May 1963.
I actually was able to listen to the tape of the conversation between LBJ and Hoover, which took place 1st thing the following morning of the assassination. It could be found on the internet in the mid-90's. Years later, when I found out it had been erased, I couldn't believe it. More solid proof of the government cover-up. ( As though there wasn't enough already). I called a friend immediately to jog his memory, as I had given him a heads up to listen to the conversation. And yes, he confirmed he had also listened to it. More evidence that's been washed and laundered through the years. The CIA knows how to do their job. And guess what? They don't have to answer to anyone, including our lawmakers. Sad but true.
Our so-called democracy is a total sham.
"They don't have to answer to anyone, including our lawmakers."
What federal agency does have to answer to the people's representatives now, even about non-classified information that has no relation to national security (unless everything relates to national security)?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_Qo8dHsgRk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwRoFapcZPQ
They fleece us out of our tax money, but we aren't allowed to know what it is spent on.
You have your own answer here, "In the best interest of the United States!" in one catch phrase the chicken hawks falsely espouse, the other is "In the interest National Security", is another. "(unless everything relates to national secuirty)? Son since the Patriot Act that is exactly the way the fascists see it.!
FYI back o April 11, here Morley presented The Trail of Destruction In New Orleans. You commented on what I had written and I replied.
You commented in the form of a series of question to me. I just now returned here from posting an apology to you and everyone else scratching your heads.
I neglected to inform the readers that I considered you very first question as being two. I intended to address this then but I got on a role of sorts and forgot, the little nugget about the first question as being one that needed two answers. It is definitely a mental glitch.
Linda Giovanna Zambanini comment below rigs true to me I'm 100% agreement.
The CIA has some very serious problems JFK had to die. CIA had LBJ and Hoover by the gonads, well at the very least they had LBJ by the gonads, I will not speculate on what they had JEH by, his skirt tails maybe.
So everyone remember this CIA went all-in, the had no choice and developed a whale of a tail, no disrespect to whales intended. Given what we have learned about this tape being erased in the middle ~ 1990's is proof they are still actively engaged in destroying evidence. Remember Jeff's comments about CIA going to extraordinary lengths to provide a cover story? Don't think for one second they are ready to give up the fight.
Kennedy had to die, or else CIA could go away. No much has changed except the stakes are higher now because the fools who continue to push the Oswald lie simply will not allow themselves to give up any of their grossly overblown powers and they have members of congress, how shall we say it without being to crass, by the genitals.
This might be the funniest thing I’ve ever seen.
https://rumble.com/v4q5ip8-nprs-new-ceo-is-the-epitome-of-evil.html
With the possible caveat that it’s not funny at all.
Shocking.
Was that the one where they agreed it was just a local murder? If so it took over 30 years or more to finally erase it.
At the top you say this conversation took place on the morning of November 22nd 1963. Contextually it seems like you meant to say November 23rd. Otherwise you have the smoking gun of the last century. Please confirm
Good catch! That is our mistake, and we will have corrected audio uploaded to this post later today.
Glad to help. In my book ASK NOT! I had many times during the editorial process to correct facts and attributions. So I know how something like that can slip by. But I must say, for a split second, I thought it was earth-shattering news! :)
I caught that too.
Dramatic, I loved it and learned from it. How dare these people manipulate the common American. Where is the outrage?
That is such a good presentation. I am sure I actually heard that tape and, from memory, it was sometime in the 70's. Many years later I discussed it with someone and went looking for it to show my dubious friend. It was gone.
Not the only piece of compelling evidence to disappear.
The sound of the 6 second intervals of audible pulses in the blank tape is reminiscent of the awful finality of the cadence of Chopin's funeral march played by the military band in JFK's procession to his final resting place at Arlington. I shall never forget that weekend.
Me neither... Good analogy, I see what you mean. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJBzm68f_qA
Also the plodding of Black Jack.
Powerful. Can you include the transcript that wasn't erased for the other members?
Check out Trail of Destruction, Pt. 1: The LBJ-Hoover Phone Call
J. Edgar Hoover was duped for many years by a Kremlin-loyal triple agent by the name of Aleksei Kulak (FEDORA) at the Bureau's NYC field office. Kulak was the KGB's "outside man" to probable KGB "mole" Bruce Solie's "inside man" in the devastating feedback loop they formed against U.S. intelligence. Solie, a high-level officer in the CIA's mole-hunting Office of Security, was the confidant, mentor, and mole-hunting boss of father figure-requiring James Angleton, and he worked closely with the FBI. It was Kulak who made Valeriy Kostikov's name "radioactive" by telling the FBI several months before Oswald allegedly went to Mexico City that Kostikov's colleague, Igor Brykin at the UN, was a member of Department 13.
Superb! It’s been my view that LBJ and JEH came to an understanding very quickly to hang it on LHO as the lone gunman. Notwithstanding neither believing it was that simple. Both put a lid on any notion of the Washington apparatus of the state being involved or duplicity. They had an understanding that as two very effective operatives in D.C. they could pull off the lone gunman theory, block CiA further mischief, ensure they both could carry on in the jobs they craved. In a short time LBJ reappoints JEH. Investigations of LBJ business in Texas fades. One could say a “grand alliance”. Most evidence points to neither believing the official narrative.
From the Mary Ferrel site : "the fact that many people and groups had motive to kill JFK, making proving motive no more than a starting point. Another dilemma for those who study the case in search of answers is the need to separate acts of coverup from the conspiracy itself."
Each new "fact"only seems to hide the truth about who or what group killed JFK. Erasing tapes, destroying or refusing to release public information after ordered to by congress seems to only add to the confusion.
The evil, murderous people behind JFK's murder were very skilled at covering the trail to the truth. These were not amateurs but professional killers and some of them are probably still alive.
Bravo
https://medium.com/@scotcomp/the-world-of-magnetic-tapes-recovery-techniques-6e90dd772372
My guess is the erased 14 mins was a discussion about the public response if it was revealed Oswald was impersonated calling the Russian consulate discussing a wet ops Russian spy.
It’s obvious this conversation was the impetus for the Katzenbach memo the next day after LHO’s death. And who knows if Hoover was told to look the other way on LHO’s security measures that day by the DPD.
Cuz we all know if Oswald was guilty, the USG woulda made sure he was alive for trial.
Jeff’s right - this is a historic 14 minutes.
You sound very similar to Peter Coyote. If someone had asked me to guess who was doing the narration, I would have guessed him.