For the past five years, I have been doing research into the military's response to the JFK assassination.
My many inquiries revealed no records on file in the military archives. It is quite perplexing because this has nothing at all to do with the events in Dealey Plaza. Most of the information that I have been able to obtain has come from the recent document dumps and the accounts of veterans who were serving that day. Overall, information about this essential part of the JFK assassination story has been fragmentary at best.
A very important set of documents which could answer many questions about the military response would be the duty logs of the National Military Command Center, ( NMCC). However, according to JFK researcher Larry Hancock in his book "Surprise Attack", these logs, specifically communications between the NMCC and other alert centers are nowhere to be found.
( "Surprise Attack", page 226).
From all that I can conclude, the reason why these documents haven't seen the light of day could be that they would show a confused, disjointed, and in many cases panicked response by the National Security Establishment. Knowledge of this at the time could have damaged the confidence of the public in the reliability and continuity of the military when dealing with a catastrophic crisis.
60 years after the fact, the lack of information on the military's reaction forms a great gap in understanding the events of that awful day in Dallas.
Here's a story I just learned about, and my first thought was that perhaps it could be proven or disproven with military records, for example with flight logs, the sergeant's records, etc.
(Air Force sergeant sees Oswald look-alike board a government plane in Dallas on day of the assassination.)
While I myself am on the fence about there being second Oswalds there are some facts that I can glean from this.
1. The C-54 aircraft was a type that was most often used by CIA contract airlines. The globe logo with longtitude and latitude on the tail of the aircraft fits the description of World Airways, based out of Oakland, California. It was a charter airline, and did in fact do contract flights for the CIA.
2. Regarding the dirt strip outside Dallas, the entry way for that particular aircraft stands at nearly twenty feet off the ground. In order to enter the aircraft one needs a ramp of some kind. The only other way to enter and egress the aircraft could be by a rope ladder.
3. Walker AFB, which is just outside of Roswell, New Mexico, was at the time a SAC base. According to accounts from SAC veterans, they did not go on alert, however that the base was on lockdown is likely as at the time Pentagon placed all military commands on DEFCON 4, of which base lockdowns are part of the procedure.
4. That Sergeant Vincent's wife was made to sign a secrecy agreement is rather unusual.
At the time the highest clearance that a senior NCO could have was a NATO Top Secret Cryptographic Nuclear Weapons clearance. This was usually authorized for Officers and senior Staff Non Commissioned Officers. Personal note- I myself held this same level of clearance during my tour in the Marines. That Master Sergeant Vincent was made to sign an additional non disclosure agreement with the CIA and later offered a job with them is indeed unusual. That he was sent to the Area 51 base is also odd, as well as him being kept under observation for a number of years.
From what I conclude from his account was that Sergeant Vincent happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and saw something he was not meant to see. Whether the individual he saw was an Oswald double is something open to question.
Nonetheless there are a number of true facts in this story that make it worth looking into.
All great points. I'm open minded about the story, but for me, it would be more credible on its face if the plane had been something like a single or twin engine Cessna. It's hard for me to imagine a giant plane like a C-54 landing in a field near Dallas and not being noticed by people on the ground.
Nonetheless, I agree it's well worth investigating.
All of the details mentioned here prove beyond doubt that the public have never been meant to see the real truth about the assassination. If the mass destruction of evidence isn’t bad enough, it’s always been my view that the really serious stuff was never written down anyway.
Does the continued incidents of files being destroyed over time, especially on or around certain dates signify the excuse used by CIA which claims the declassification of certain files would lead to the revelation of sources and methods has nothing to actually do with the reason the files have not been released but instead systematically destroyed. While the destroyed files would very likely expose the details of a "Murder Most Foul", who, why, when ,what, how, we already have a good deal of information about. No valid justifiable reason currently exists to continue a botched coverup of this crime. American needs the truth.
The act of 'freezing' the files by use of security restrictions as allowed in a very broad interpretation of DOJ's ruling on the unproven claim revelation of such files would reveal sources and methods when no evidence has been presented to prove this claim, ever. The reveal is actual fact, isn't the motive for not releasing the information for the purpose of clandestinely destroying the records over time to prevent factual reconstruction of a crime which the CIA is well known to have lied about alredy. Lies discovered by facts revealed overtime from still existing files which prove the CIA lied.
Has anyone came forward from CIA to direct courts and or investigators to the notion these factual revelations have in fact revealed anything other than CIA officials lied about CIA's criminal involvement to represent CIA's claim of ignorance of facts related to the issue of CIA involvrment, being debated. CIA didn't know this, CIA didn't know that, when in fact evidence in CIA's own files proves CIA lied about what they knew and claimed to be ignorant of.
If we are expected to believe the sources and methods ruse those who keep the secrets need to realize the weight carried by the definition of the lie, "a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth,"
Note: "ignorantia juris non excusat"
Denial of knowledge has been revealed as a weak excuse. 'We had no information about, a, b, or c', has been proven to be untrue by evidence to the contrary. The act of revelation was a result of the agencies inability to prove their actual ignorance of knowledge to the contrary. Evidence they in fact did have however proved they claimed falsely they were ignorant of. Ignorance proven by evidence to the contrary, which in truth is no excuse for CIA's behavior, as witnessed by such evidence.
The friggin' CIA double-speak lies caught up to them. In this day and age of computers there exist no real secrets. CIA's method in this case is to lie and the purpose of the lie is the source of the deception. It worked for years, now not so much!
The destruction of the records is their last desperate attempt at the deception. The attempted concealment of the planing and execution of (executive action) capitol murder. Murder of a sitting POTUS. Time is running out. "Res ipsa loquitur!"
Outstanding list of horrors, Chad. It is hard to select the most outrageous of the bunch. One wonders what it means when Angleton has RFK autopsy photos. Truly frightening at the implications. One also wonders who gave authority to Kolaris to destroy all those Angleton records. Google shows Colby called on Kolaris to replace Angleton at XMAS 1974 and of course Ford was President as of August 9, 1974. So it all adds up.
Can we ever free ourselves from the secret government surveillance state that we live in where every piece of important information is denied to the citizenry? I don't see how.
The elected president is even denied the right to appoint people who are perceived as a threat to unnecessary government secrecy.
"Tulsi Gabbard's DNI nomination triggers pro-war freakout":
Chad great work, and this effort of yours sets me off.
Great recap of exactly what happens when an institution capable of the activities CIA was and presumably is allowed, with no oversight, to involve themselves in extrajudicial activities such as, kidnapping and executions. The results in a good many cases of the CIA have been, let us just say, much less than desirable.
As a result I ventured into a space similar to that CIA seems to occupy. The sphere of their own creation in which they do as they please which in truth has little in common with the reality of social actions found in the general population world wide.
My effort mocking the agency demanded I make what would generally considered 'outrageous' to those versed in the application of the science and art of practicing the law. I see my effort as not only justified but necessary to make my point. Sometimes the only way to fight fire is with fire.
In their efforts made to distance themselves from any culpability involving the JFK murder by feigning ignorance of any facts suggesting otherwise , CIA brought on the issue being held unaccountable due to a absolute lack of any knowledge of Lee Harvey Oswald, period.
CIA's very obvious inability to manage their highly classified affairs has been exposed, beyond any shadow of a doubt, until and unless the agency proves other wise.
As a result of CIA's totally unreasonable efforts to maintain this and other positions in order to protect there sources and methods lost any legitimate bearing on the issues involved in my opinion. The efforts to achieve transparency and justice, calls for extrajudicial actions by those attempting to reveal CIA deceptions to avoid responsibility. This is a method of effort to expose CIA's miserably week claims of being ignorant of pertinent facts directly related to LHO and the JFK murder. In doing so their efforts entered into total fiction, an area of their creation reaching the point where it introduced such outlandish elements of fiction to their activities in this operation, now having been revealed, exposes their inept effort to avoid detection. ' Jumping the shark' as it were.
Simply put certain CIA officials got in over their heads, a reality which has never been fully addressed by our government. This gross misconduct must be addressed and no better time exists than right now.
Absolute failure of responsibility by our government should have been a teachable moment. This opportunity must not be lost. Current appearances indicate a government left to it's own devices serves only itself.
Have a good day Chad, you seem to be onto something.
I honestly believe that the JFK murder was a National Security Execution conceived and conducted by the military, and subsequently covered up by the military. (ONI)
The CIA was complicit in “sheep-dipping” Oswald as a Communist and providing their phony book warehouse as a set to be used for the “story”. “Captain”Westbrook was instrumental in the framing of Oswald and certainly seemed involved in the Tippett murder based on his ridiculous answers to what he was doing in Oak Cliff 30 minutes after JFK was killed.
I also believe that Greer and Kellerman were instructed to bring the Presidential car to a near standstill at a prescribed spot on Elm Street. Their livelihood and their loved ones were at risk if they didn’t follow through. This would explain Greer looking backwards 2 times as the bullets “rained down on them”
I have never seen a more passive “protecter”than the impassive, immobile and impotent Kellerman, waiting for the kill shot before suggesting to the back seat staring Greer to get out of here.
Bethesda Naval Hospital (BNH) provided the phony autopsy to cover up the murder.
BNH was also the site of the James Forrestal ( our country’s first Secretary of Defense) murder, he was thrown out a window while being on suicide watch.
And Senator James McCarthy was admitted to BNH for a knee operation and was dead in 2 days from liver failure.
He was put in an “Oxygen”tent and his last 2 visitors were LBJ and Prescott Bush.
I am not surprised that the military destroyed their records.
The question is why were these 3 Men all killed?
National Security?
They all possessed knowledge of the alien presence.
Weren't there eyewitness interviews that the 112th MIG was there on 11/22?
"....The 112th Military Intelligence Group (MIG), known in 1963 as the 112th Intelligence Corps (INTC), was attached to the U.S. 4th Army, based at Fort Sam Houston in San Antonio
For the past five years, I have been doing research into the military's response to the JFK assassination.
My many inquiries revealed no records on file in the military archives. It is quite perplexing because this has nothing at all to do with the events in Dealey Plaza. Most of the information that I have been able to obtain has come from the recent document dumps and the accounts of veterans who were serving that day. Overall, information about this essential part of the JFK assassination story has been fragmentary at best.
A very important set of documents which could answer many questions about the military response would be the duty logs of the National Military Command Center, ( NMCC). However, according to JFK researcher Larry Hancock in his book "Surprise Attack", these logs, specifically communications between the NMCC and other alert centers are nowhere to be found.
( "Surprise Attack", page 226).
From all that I can conclude, the reason why these documents haven't seen the light of day could be that they would show a confused, disjointed, and in many cases panicked response by the National Security Establishment. Knowledge of this at the time could have damaged the confidence of the public in the reliability and continuity of the military when dealing with a catastrophic crisis.
60 years after the fact, the lack of information on the military's reaction forms a great gap in understanding the events of that awful day in Dallas.
Here's a story I just learned about, and my first thought was that perhaps it could be proven or disproven with military records, for example with flight logs, the sergeant's records, etc.
(Air Force sergeant sees Oswald look-alike board a government plane in Dallas on day of the assassination.)
https://youtu.be/PreyRL-zz0c?si=7396eWiCsIpgi3Lc
On the other hand, if this story is true, all the records relating to it would have been prime candidates for destruction.
An interesting and intriguing story.
While I myself am on the fence about there being second Oswalds there are some facts that I can glean from this.
1. The C-54 aircraft was a type that was most often used by CIA contract airlines. The globe logo with longtitude and latitude on the tail of the aircraft fits the description of World Airways, based out of Oakland, California. It was a charter airline, and did in fact do contract flights for the CIA.
2. Regarding the dirt strip outside Dallas, the entry way for that particular aircraft stands at nearly twenty feet off the ground. In order to enter the aircraft one needs a ramp of some kind. The only other way to enter and egress the aircraft could be by a rope ladder.
3. Walker AFB, which is just outside of Roswell, New Mexico, was at the time a SAC base. According to accounts from SAC veterans, they did not go on alert, however that the base was on lockdown is likely as at the time Pentagon placed all military commands on DEFCON 4, of which base lockdowns are part of the procedure.
4. That Sergeant Vincent's wife was made to sign a secrecy agreement is rather unusual.
At the time the highest clearance that a senior NCO could have was a NATO Top Secret Cryptographic Nuclear Weapons clearance. This was usually authorized for Officers and senior Staff Non Commissioned Officers. Personal note- I myself held this same level of clearance during my tour in the Marines. That Master Sergeant Vincent was made to sign an additional non disclosure agreement with the CIA and later offered a job with them is indeed unusual. That he was sent to the Area 51 base is also odd, as well as him being kept under observation for a number of years.
From what I conclude from his account was that Sergeant Vincent happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and saw something he was not meant to see. Whether the individual he saw was an Oswald double is something open to question.
Nonetheless there are a number of true facts in this story that make it worth looking into.
All great points. I'm open minded about the story, but for me, it would be more credible on its face if the plane had been something like a single or twin engine Cessna. It's hard for me to imagine a giant plane like a C-54 landing in a field near Dallas and not being noticed by people on the ground.
Nonetheless, I agree it's well worth investigating.
All of the details mentioned here prove beyond doubt that the public have never been meant to see the real truth about the assassination. If the mass destruction of evidence isn’t bad enough, it’s always been my view that the really serious stuff was never written down anyway.
Does the continued incidents of files being destroyed over time, especially on or around certain dates signify the excuse used by CIA which claims the declassification of certain files would lead to the revelation of sources and methods has nothing to actually do with the reason the files have not been released but instead systematically destroyed. While the destroyed files would very likely expose the details of a "Murder Most Foul", who, why, when ,what, how, we already have a good deal of information about. No valid justifiable reason currently exists to continue a botched coverup of this crime. American needs the truth.
The act of 'freezing' the files by use of security restrictions as allowed in a very broad interpretation of DOJ's ruling on the unproven claim revelation of such files would reveal sources and methods when no evidence has been presented to prove this claim, ever. The reveal is actual fact, isn't the motive for not releasing the information for the purpose of clandestinely destroying the records over time to prevent factual reconstruction of a crime which the CIA is well known to have lied about alredy. Lies discovered by facts revealed overtime from still existing files which prove the CIA lied.
Has anyone came forward from CIA to direct courts and or investigators to the notion these factual revelations have in fact revealed anything other than CIA officials lied about CIA's criminal involvement to represent CIA's claim of ignorance of facts related to the issue of CIA involvrment, being debated. CIA didn't know this, CIA didn't know that, when in fact evidence in CIA's own files proves CIA lied about what they knew and claimed to be ignorant of.
If we are expected to believe the sources and methods ruse those who keep the secrets need to realize the weight carried by the definition of the lie, "a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth,"
Note: "ignorantia juris non excusat"
Denial of knowledge has been revealed as a weak excuse. 'We had no information about, a, b, or c', has been proven to be untrue by evidence to the contrary. The act of revelation was a result of the agencies inability to prove their actual ignorance of knowledge to the contrary. Evidence they in fact did have however proved they claimed falsely they were ignorant of. Ignorance proven by evidence to the contrary, which in truth is no excuse for CIA's behavior, as witnessed by such evidence.
The friggin' CIA double-speak lies caught up to them. In this day and age of computers there exist no real secrets. CIA's method in this case is to lie and the purpose of the lie is the source of the deception. It worked for years, now not so much!
The destruction of the records is their last desperate attempt at the deception. The attempted concealment of the planing and execution of (executive action) capitol murder. Murder of a sitting POTUS. Time is running out. "Res ipsa loquitur!"
Outstanding list of horrors, Chad. It is hard to select the most outrageous of the bunch. One wonders what it means when Angleton has RFK autopsy photos. Truly frightening at the implications. One also wonders who gave authority to Kolaris to destroy all those Angleton records. Google shows Colby called on Kolaris to replace Angleton at XMAS 1974 and of course Ford was President as of August 9, 1974. So it all adds up.
Along with the Secret Service, ONI. etc.
Can we ever free ourselves from the secret government surveillance state that we live in where every piece of important information is denied to the citizenry? I don't see how.
The elected president is even denied the right to appoint people who are perceived as a threat to unnecessary government secrecy.
"Tulsi Gabbard's DNI nomination triggers pro-war freakout":
https://youtu.be/64ySypQa0Kc?si=hWSqvyw-GYS9WwIb
"Establishment & Media Speechless Over the Thought of Tulsi Gabbard Pardoning Edward Snowden":
https://youtu.be/KVV-EcFjJRs?si=DdvXmoD7_4mDhGTo
I suppose I have grown weary of restating the obvious.
Chad great work, and this effort of yours sets me off.
Great recap of exactly what happens when an institution capable of the activities CIA was and presumably is allowed, with no oversight, to involve themselves in extrajudicial activities such as, kidnapping and executions. The results in a good many cases of the CIA have been, let us just say, much less than desirable.
As a result I ventured into a space similar to that CIA seems to occupy. The sphere of their own creation in which they do as they please which in truth has little in common with the reality of social actions found in the general population world wide.
My effort mocking the agency demanded I make what would generally considered 'outrageous' to those versed in the application of the science and art of practicing the law. I see my effort as not only justified but necessary to make my point. Sometimes the only way to fight fire is with fire.
In their efforts made to distance themselves from any culpability involving the JFK murder by feigning ignorance of any facts suggesting otherwise , CIA brought on the issue being held unaccountable due to a absolute lack of any knowledge of Lee Harvey Oswald, period.
CIA's very obvious inability to manage their highly classified affairs has been exposed, beyond any shadow of a doubt, until and unless the agency proves other wise.
As a result of CIA's totally unreasonable efforts to maintain this and other positions in order to protect there sources and methods lost any legitimate bearing on the issues involved in my opinion. The efforts to achieve transparency and justice, calls for extrajudicial actions by those attempting to reveal CIA deceptions to avoid responsibility. This is a method of effort to expose CIA's miserably week claims of being ignorant of pertinent facts directly related to LHO and the JFK murder. In doing so their efforts entered into total fiction, an area of their creation reaching the point where it introduced such outlandish elements of fiction to their activities in this operation, now having been revealed, exposes their inept effort to avoid detection. ' Jumping the shark' as it were.
Simply put certain CIA officials got in over their heads, a reality which has never been fully addressed by our government. This gross misconduct must be addressed and no better time exists than right now.
Absolute failure of responsibility by our government should have been a teachable moment. This opportunity must not be lost. Current appearances indicate a government left to it's own devices serves only itself.
Have a good day Chad, you seem to be onto something.
The CIA should be put into something like Chapter 11 bankruptcy if not Chapter 7.
I honestly believe that the JFK murder was a National Security Execution conceived and conducted by the military, and subsequently covered up by the military. (ONI)
The CIA was complicit in “sheep-dipping” Oswald as a Communist and providing their phony book warehouse as a set to be used for the “story”. “Captain”Westbrook was instrumental in the framing of Oswald and certainly seemed involved in the Tippett murder based on his ridiculous answers to what he was doing in Oak Cliff 30 minutes after JFK was killed.
I also believe that Greer and Kellerman were instructed to bring the Presidential car to a near standstill at a prescribed spot on Elm Street. Their livelihood and their loved ones were at risk if they didn’t follow through. This would explain Greer looking backwards 2 times as the bullets “rained down on them”
I have never seen a more passive “protecter”than the impassive, immobile and impotent Kellerman, waiting for the kill shot before suggesting to the back seat staring Greer to get out of here.
Bethesda Naval Hospital (BNH) provided the phony autopsy to cover up the murder.
BNH was also the site of the James Forrestal ( our country’s first Secretary of Defense) murder, he was thrown out a window while being on suicide watch.
And Senator James McCarthy was admitted to BNH for a knee operation and was dead in 2 days from liver failure.
He was put in an “Oxygen”tent and his last 2 visitors were LBJ and Prescott Bush.
I am not surprised that the military destroyed their records.
The question is why were these 3 Men all killed?
National Security?
They all possessed knowledge of the alien presence.
FYI - the LBJ Library is in Austin, not Lubbock.
Weren't there eyewitness interviews that the 112th MIG was there on 11/22?
"....The 112th Military Intelligence Group (MIG), known in 1963 as the 112th Intelligence Corps (INTC), was attached to the U.S. 4th Army, based at Fort Sam Houston in San Antonio